BroadwayBK
BroadwayBK

Students No Longer Gifted

Apparently some students are being told that they are no longer gifted, because of new higher standards for entry into New York's gifted program:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/01/education/01schools.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion

This of course in keeping with our favorite theme lately.

The new standards are intended to make up in recent inflations in the school's standards and dropping performance rates. What do you guys think? It looks like charter schools are not the greatest educational facilities after all.
The opinions expressed here are those of the individual and not those of StreetAdvisor.
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ajadedidealist
ajadedidealist 2yrs+
Oh, those crazy budget woes again... Really, I think this will be horribly damaging for kids' self-esteem (and I don't normally say this). If someone decided "oh, you're not gifted" when I was a kid, I would have been pretty darn scarred
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DBlack
DBlack 2yrs+
OK, this one is really tricky. Although everybody is traumatized by a sudden plunge in scores, it's probably a good idea to stop inflating scores to begin with. Score inflation doesn't address the huge number of socail and economic factors that contribute to minorities scoring low on tests to begin with. It just whitewashes the problem (pun intended). In the long run, it's probably best, as a matter of policy, for schools to LIE about the performance of their students instead of TRYING HARDER to fix the problems. But this is one of those topics where a lot of people have something to say, though not everybody has any idea how to really make things better.
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BroadwayBK
BroadwayBK 2yrs+
@DBlack Agreed.
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ajadedidealist
ajadedidealist 2yrs+
It is a fair question, though. How do we measure gifted? Have any of you been following the story of gifted magnet school Hunter College High School? It reveals several interesting facets to the story.
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JenMac
JenMac 2yrs+
Score inflations are crap. If everyone got the mark they deserved, then yeah, they'd all be low for a while. Then some ahole will start getting actual good scores and everyone will have to follow suit or perish. That's how it worked at my school. All of us nerds obsessively studied so that we could pull Raoul Dhillon of his ridiculously high horse. He kicked our butts, number-wise, BUT we all went to really good colleges. Survival of the fittest and kids are competitive.
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hhusted
hhusted 2yrs+
If someone, especially a teacher, told my parents that I was not gifted, and they knew I was, especially based on previous test results, my parents would have flipped out on the teacher or the school and pulled me out of it.

I don't know how parents react in this day and age. Would they do the same or not. I can't answer that. But that is a good basis for a discussion about it.
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BroadwayBK
BroadwayBK 2yrs+
@hhusted The problem is that their status was based on inflated scores. Not that it isn't horrible to suddenly tell a child they're not gifted anymore.
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hhusted
hhusted 2yrs+
@BroadwayBK: How would you like it if an authority figure came to your face and told you that you were no longer gifted. I think you would be upset about it, and maybe said a thing or two.

I understand about inflated scores, if the school altered them on purpose just to pass the students, which showed the students did not have the brains to answer the questions to begin with. But to tell a student he/she is not gifted is outright mean.
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BroadwayBK
BroadwayBK 2yrs+
@hhusted That's what I just said - that it wasn't right to do to kids.
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hhusted
hhusted 2yrs+
@BroadwayBK: I guess it is the way you said it that made me think otherwise. Thanks for clearing that up.
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uptowngirl
uptowngirl 2yrs+
@DBlack have to agree with you inflated scores are ridiculous.

@Everyone This practice seems prevalent around the world. In Mumbai for instance in order to get into a Med or Engineering program you have to score almost 100% in Physics, Chemistry and Math to get a shot at seat in a prestigious college. Its absolutely crazy and those that do get in are naturally considered to be 'gifted' when in actuality they maybe just swots who spend all their time studying and do nothing else.
Also I have increasingly noticed that its not these swots who really make it in life its the students who were pretty mediocre in school but have the street smarts that really hit the 'big time' so as to speak. In my opinion its these kids who are truly 'gifted'.
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Uraniumfish
Uraniumfish 2yrs+
@uptowngirl You're right that smarts is a complex thing that doesn't just show up in test scores. Sometimes the people who end up doing the interesting things in life were the college dropouts, rather than the people who got PhD's.

BTW, what's a swot? Love the sound of that word.
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BroadwayBK
BroadwayBK 2yrs+
@uptowngirl And not only do you need to do a lot of studying to score high on a test like that, but you have to have the means to do it. Someone else has to be paying the bills for you to get enough studying time in, really.
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Uraniumfish
Uraniumfish 2yrs+
@BroadwayBK Good point.
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uptowngirl
uptowngirl 2yrs+
@BroadwayBK so true, they all have extra tutors and what not to help them get those high scores and those extra tutors cost a lot

@Uraniumfish swot is colloquial for someone who is always 'mugging' i.e. studying and doing nothing esle
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JenMac
JenMac 2yrs+
Don't a lot of colleges look for well-roundedness nowadays?
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hhusted
hhusted 2yrs+
@BroadwayBK: Yes, I agree. Obviously someone is sponsoring the person. How else is the person taking care of himself, if he is constantly studying.
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uptowngirl
uptowngirl 2yrs+
@JenMac I think so but I think for courses like Medicene and Engineering ( in India) grades matter the most.
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hhusted
hhusted 2yrs+
@uptowngirl; Don't most universities in India put pressure on students to be top gun or else. Like their lives depend on it or they will die if they do not graduate with top honors?
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uptowngirl
uptowngirl 2yrs+
@hhusted I don't only think it is the schools and colleges, ambitious parents and aspirational students..there are a whole lot of factors at play.
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Uraniumfish
Uraniumfish 2yrs+
@uptowngirl Plus I'm guessing that in a society with a whole lot of poor people and only a few rich, getting a top job is one of the few ways you can guarantee your own economic security. which is a pretty motivating thing.
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